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Is this a Timing Problem?

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7.4K views 12 replies 4 participants last post by  19and41  
#1 ·
I don’t know what the problem is so, I need some advice and/or recommendations from all you experts. While cleaning my 4-inch, Model 617-4, I notice that lead has built-up between the Forcing Cone and the Top Strap, and a little along the sides of the Forcing Cone. In fact, some lead has run down from the Forcing Cone onto the Yoke. I tried to check the timing, to see if this was causing the problem. But, after putting the gun in Full Lock-up, I could not get any light to shine in behind the cylinder in order to check the barrel and chamber alignments. I tried removing the lead with M-Pro 7 and a brass/bronze brush but, it did not work. I also tried a plastic dental pick and it too (obviously), did not work. I did not want to use a metal pick and scratch the surface.

I don’t know if this means anything but, I only use CCI, Federal, and Winchester ammunition When I shot it the last time, I was using Winchester ammo and I noticed that there was quite a bit of smoke coming from each round that was fired. I was wondering if this was a bad run of ammo from the factory.


OK, now for all the questions:

1). Is this or does this appear to be a Timing problem?

2). If this is a Timing problem, what is the procedure for sending the gun back to S&W and who do I contact there? Is there one person that I should be contacting?

3). Typically, how long is the turn around time for the factory, once I send it?

4). I am not the original owner. Do you know if there will be a fee for repairs, or will S&W cover it?

and finally,

5). How can I clean the lead from between the Forcing Cone and Top Strap, and from the Yoke? Or will the factory do this if I send it back?


Thanks in advance, for your advice and/or recommendations.

Kirt
 
G
#3 ·
Is this the only time that this has happened?

Keep slight thumb pressure on the cylinder as you cycle the hammer in single action. Does the gun go into full lock-up at the top of the cycle ~ or does the cylinder still rotate just a little before you hear the click of the cylinder stop?
 
#6 ·
Gizamo,

I'm not sure I understand what you want me to do. Do you want me to pull back on the cylinder and measure the distance between the forcing cone and the cylinder on both sides? Is this to determine if the cylinder is mounted at a slight angle to the forcing cone?

By the way, thanks for taking the time to help me out with this problem...I really appreciate it!

Kirt
 
#7 ·
There is a button at the bottom of the frame. This is called a cylinder stop. Make sure it snaps into each slot for each chamber. If it does the timing is OK.
Most likely it's the 22 bullets. They are grossly dirty. I use a dull knife and scrape it off the top strap when I shoot cheap bullets.
Try another brand like CCI Blazers, these are not expensive but shoot well. The gun doesn't get so dirty either. Brands like thunderbolt stay away from.
 
#9 ·
Its difficult to tell without having the revolver in hand. From what you are describing, it sounds to me like the normal build up of lead and semi-burned residue that we all see, between the forcing cone and the frame. It shows up well against a stainless frame, and it ain't pretty.
A timing problem on a 617, not impossible, but I think unlikely. Its way too new a model. I would also think you'd be experiencing some lead spitting, especially after a lot of shooting. Your accuracy on targets would likely be suffering too, but you haven't mentioned either symptom, so I doubt you have a timing problem.
The 22 ammo we all get stuck with is kind of a 1 size fits all, the factory it came from makes the stuff and we get stuck having to use it in rifle or handgun. There is no separate 22 ammo for the handgun, with powder that burns faster than that for rifle, the results we get is very dirty residue that builds up quickly. Especially in that spot you have posted about. Its likely normal and nothing to worry about, more than anything it means you are shooting your revolver a lot, which is of course the whole idea, right? If you get yourself a revolver made by a different company, thinking that this will solve the issue, I can tell you that it won't. You will get the same residue build up in the same spot on the others too.
Scraping it off works, soak it in some Hoppe's. I use those small, toothbrush sized wire brushes sometimes, but in bronze bristles, not stainless. I've seen and taken home revolvers with a LOT of this build up, like completely filling the gap it builds up in, and with some patience, the Hoppe's, and a bit of care, it can be removed with something like a utility knife blade, or the small blade of a pocket knife, but it might take a little while to get it to loosen up first, before it gives up its grip on the steel frame of the gun. It might take a while and several soak/scrape attempts before it lets go. There is also the end of a screw in there on a lot of revolvers, its the front screw from the adjustable rear sight assembly above it on top of the frame. So don't damage that or spend hours trying to scrape it off. :lol:
The other members might know a good trick or 2 to clean up this area, something better than I have to offer. I'll bet that if you get this area cleaned up, and then show the gun to a gunsmith, or someone who knows how to check the timing, you'll get told there isn't anything wrong with it.
 
#10 ·
Thanks everyone for your input...I appreciate it!

Gizamo,

Per your suggestion, I measured the distance between the forcing cone and the cylinder, and it is the same on both sides at 0.035".

Geoff40,

You made two comments that I failed to mention in my original thread, and that is that the gun is not experiencing any lead spitting that I am aware of, and that it is very accurate! I'll will take yours and 500 Magnum's advise and just soak it and use a small pen knife to remove the lead.

I do use this gun alot...it is so Damn FUN to shoot!!

Again, Thanks all for your input!!!

Kirt
 
#11 ·
takedeadaim said:
Thanks everyone for your input...I appreciate it!

Gizamo,

Per your suggestion, I measured the distance between the forcing cone and the cylinder, and it is the same on both sides at 0.035".
You must mean .0035 inch.

.035 is a huge air gap that's like 8 sheets of paper thick.
 
#13 ·
I use a xacto 1/4" knife to get into tight spaces like that. The opposite side of the blade from the edge has a flat edge that cleans out crevices pretty well, and a sharp one will do light careful scraping of flat surfaces. I get the dispenser packs of blades and use a 600 grit diamond stone to get a couple of lives from each blade.