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Discussion Starter #1
Can anyone explain to me why my 1917 will work just fine with Half Moon Clips but bind up when I put Full Moon Clips or .45 Auto Rim in there?

My .455 Triple lock has the same issue, I thought it was just a half finished conversion job for the longest time. It occurred to me that maybe the problem I was having with my 1917 and Full Moon Clips / .45AR was the same problem I was having with the Triple Lock. Sure enough, when I tossed half moon clips in there it worked just fine.

I'm just having a hard time understanding why this is. I figure it has to be something about how tight the tolerances are on Smith & Wessons compared to my other .45ACP revolver (a Colt 1917). It still doesn't quite computer with me though.

Anyway, because I am talking about them, here are the guns in question:

 

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Jeeze SS, I don't rightly know what the problem is..................It doesn't make sense to me and sitting here, I can't figure it.

My 1917 S&W's both work fine with either half or full moon clips.........and candidly, I've never tried auto rim in either gun.

It'll be interesting to hear opinions about this.

Regards,

Geezer
 

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make mine 45 acp 😎
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I run full moon clips in my 1917 (brazilian), and use the same clips (wilson) in my 25 and my 625.. no issues..
Dont shoot any auto rim..
 

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It makes sense that the half-moon clips have two points of articulation that the full moons do not. Similarly the Auto-Rim is fixed and rigid, and a post war development. One wonders what criteria governed Major Wesson in creating the half-moon clips. Full-moon would not lend it self to web pouches and would be more prone to injury in field conditions. I would be inclined to check the cylinder to shield clearance in all three out of curiousity. You might want to check the cylinder length at each chamber especially on the Triplelock to see if the shave is a bit eccentric.

As always, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
 

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I saw a 1917 army at the Berea Gun show this Saturday at the Buckeye gun table it had a 685 sticker on it but I would give it a 65% in condition..
 

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Discussion Starter #6
It makes sense that the half-moon clips have two points of articulation that the full moons do not. Similarly the Auto-Rim is fixed and rigid, and a post war development. One wonder what criteria governed Major Wesson in creating the half-moon clips. Full-moon would not lend it self to web pouches and would be more prone to injury in field conditions. I would be inclined to check the cylinder to shield clearance in all three out of curiousity. You might want to check the cylinder length at each chamber especially on the Triplelock to see if the shave is a bit eccentric.

As always, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!"
Turns out I can't actually get my micrometer in there correctly. Need a different one I expect.

But, I did discover something interesting. The 1917 certainly does have more clearance, but when I tossed my used brass in half moon clips into the 1917 something interesting happened.


Here's the Triple Lock:




Here's the same set of half moons in the Colt:




Here they are in the S&W 1917 (note the overlap on the right side? Kind of hard to see):




After a bit of tinkering I realized that the fit on all three sets is really tight, the clips have to be in there just right.

I'm thinking that my picking up moon clips all willy nilly over the past few years might actually be my problem. I know some are USGI, but others, who knows where they came from?

I think I am going to need to spend some time figuring out which moon clips I have are made to the correct size and which are not. The colt seems to take whatever I toss into it, but both of the Smiths just seem to need very specific sized half moon clips.
 

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Check the forcing cone to cylinder and headspace gaps. You may need to change the bushings to restore headspace.
 

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Turns out I can't actually get my micrometer in there correctly. Need a different one I expect.

But, I did discover something interesting. The 1917 certainly does have more clearance, but when I tossed my used brass in half moon clips into the 1917 something interesting happened.


Here's the Triple Lock:




Here's the same set of half moons in the Colt:




Here they are in the S&W 1917 (note the overlap on the right side? Kind of hard to see):




After a bit of tinkering I realized that the fit on all three sets is really tight, the clips have to be in there just right.

I'm thinking that my picking up moon clips all willy nilly over the past few years might actually be my problem. I know some are USGI, but others, who knows where they came from?

I think I am going to need to spend some time figuring out which moon clips I have are made to the correct size and which are not. The colt seems to take whatever I toss into it, but both of the Smiths just seem to need very specific sized half moon clips.
I don't know if I'm seeing this correctly because photos can be deceiving.............but in the last photo, it looks like the top half moon clip is sitting flush on the cylinder face and the lower half moon clip ends are over lapping the first ones (subsequently, not sitting flush on the cylinder face). If that's the case, there's at least one of the problems. Also, if that's the case, then me thinks it's the half moon clip that's problematic and not the revolver itself.

The auto rim is another situation all together.............

Regards,

Geezer
 

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I've had the opposite experience with my Colt New Service Model 1917. It's handles the 1/2 moon clips, but some of the full-moon clips seem to cause some binding on one or two cylinders. I guess this could be attributed to cylinder runout, or thickness variations in the full-moon clips themselves. I just loaded up some half-moon clips and full-moon clips, and tested them out in my just-purchased Model 1917 S&W, and everything works very smoothly.

I also wonder if the variances could be attributable to rim thickness variations, combined with cylinder/recoil shield variations.
 

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1917

Hey Six Gun,

First, looks as though some of your brass has been through an auto. Ejector dings will impede performance in a revolver.

Second, your full moon clips need to be less than .040", in thickness. (a quick pass on the belt sander will fix any thick ones)

Third, have found de-bulging all of my revolver brass (head first), keeps the brass from "flowing" into the extractor groove. (being pushed there, by the sizing die.

Fourth, every 45 acp revolver I have fooled with had at least one charge hole "under sized". (most had three or more, easily fixed with a chamber reamer)

Fifth, for cast bullet success, one wants to "throat" the front part of the charge hole, as well.

Later, Mark
 

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Buy yourself a set of feeler guages at the auto parts store. Stack them to get your shield to cylinder gap, then measure the stack with your caliper. Use the feelers to check your check the barrel to cylinder.

I think I am seeing binding and perhaps an overlap in one instance. I haven't experienced this in my own, original or shaved ; Colt, S&W or Webley. But, you are going to make me look a little closer.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Buy yourself a set of feeler guages at the auto parts store. Stack them to get your shield to cylinder gap, then measure the stack with your caliper. Use the feelers to check your check the barrel to cylinder.

I think I am seeing binding and perhaps an overlap in one instance. I haven't experienced this in my own, original or shaved ; Colt, S&W or Webley. But, you are going to make me look a little closer.
Yeah, the 1917 S&W has that overlap problem, the Triple Lock is very tight, and the colt just drops in without a problem.
 
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