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In Texas Sunday a guy walked into a church and shot two people. A private citizen pulled out his gun and shot him dead. In September Sleepy Joe said this never happens. Julian Castro said, after the incident, it never happens.
These idiots don't have a clue.:eek:
Jim
 

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Turns out the guy who shot the gunman was an ex reserve sheriff's deputy, and who owns a commercial gun range. Single shot to the head; best I can guess from the video it was from around 25 feet. First shot to last shot took around 2 seconds. First appearance of the shotgun to last shot was around 4 seconds. From confronting the guy, who had an obviously fake beard and wig, wearing a long coat, to last shot was around 6 seconds. Response time just doesn't get any better, unless they murdered the guy before he showed to be a threat.

Prayers for the congregation and particularly the reserve deputy, who was the real hero that day. It's going to haunt him forever. He's getting by for now with knowing "he killed an evil". There were perhaps 6 other congregants who were armed, so regardless, the gunman wasn't getting far.

Gunman had a misdemeanor deadly conduct beef, and several unpaid tickets. Somewhat of a vagrant. He had been to the church before, and was approached to see if he needed help. This is how he repays that kindness.

Hero used a Sig P229 chambered in .357 Sig.

Pretty good shooting for an incident that just never happens ... until it happens to you.
 

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"kilt"? He was a Scot?..............:D
 
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Turns out the guy who shot the gunman was an ex reserve sheriff's deputy, and who owns a commercial gun range. Single shot to the head; best I can guess from the video it was from around 25 feet. First shot to last shot took around 2 seconds. First appearance of the shotgun to last shot was around 4 seconds. From confronting the guy, who had an obviously fake beard and wig, wearing a long coat, to last shot was around 6 seconds. Response time just doesn't get any better, unless they murdered the guy before he showed to be a threat.

Prayers for the congregation and particularly the reserve deputy, who was the real hero that day. It's going to haunt him forever. He's getting by for now with knowing "he killed an evil". There were perhaps 6 other congregants who were armed, so regardless, the gunman wasn't getting far.

Gunman had a misdemeanor deadly conduct beef, and several unpaid tickets. Somewhat of a vagrant. He had been to the church before, and was approached to see if he needed help. This is how he repays that kindness.

Hero used a Sig P229 chambered in .357 Sig.

Pretty good shooting for an incident that just never happens ... until it happens to you.
Guess that would make not going to church a good thing then, eh? ;)
 
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The whole incident doesn't fit in the legacy media anti-gun owner agenda. Watch how fast it disappears from media coverage.

Facts keep interfering with their leftist socialist fantasies.
 

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Guess that would make not going to church a good thing then, eh? ;)
Odd observation! Guess it's really better to never leave the house ...? Oh wait, then the invaders come to you. Guess you just can't win.
 

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Interesting outtakes for me from the video........

The guy that first tried to draw on the shotgun pointed at him: Probably a bad decision first of all, maybe he could have kept the guy talking........second.......his fast draw was incredibly slow and clumsy. Had he ever practiced this move? Third......if he really felt he HAD to draw with a shotgun in his face, he should have moved, maybe even taken a dive to side to the floor as he drew.

Anything to improve his small chance of survival.

He did accomplish something.......at least he made the shooter focus on him and gave others the chance to draw.

Then there's the hero.......I make it to be ten yards or a little more distance between him and the shooter........yet he shot the guy in the head........and the guy was MOVING.

Can we believe that he actually aimed for the guy's HEAD???

That flies in the face of all training and logic........he should have been aiming center mass, right?

I suspect he aimed center mass and shot high. At least he was accurate in the horizontal plane.

Good to keep in mind that we tend to shoot high in those deadly stressful situations. I guess in our hurry we don't get that front sight down where it should be.

Also........I was amazed at how many people were sitting upright or even standing upright in those few seconds and right after.........the pastor was eating carpet as he should have been, but the congregation was not.

This is Texas, after all.......you'd think they'd have a good instinct for what to do when bullets are flying.

I hope they have a good "Lessons Learned" session to review this mess.........and I hope other churches review it and learn from it.

Training and more training.......practice and more practice.........is what we need.

Lastly.........they deserve credit for having a security team in place and ready. So many don't.
 
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Can we believe that he actually aimed for the guy's HEAD?
If you need an instant takedown, you need to shut off the computer. Well done IMO.
 
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We have security teams that are members at our church that rotate every couple weeks. During the couple times a week that I there in the evenings, I'm armed. Nobody knows it but I'm armed just in case ;)
Just like the Gentleman that stopped that gunman in the Texas Church was asked by the media, "How does it feel to kill a Human." He Relied, "I did not kill a human, I killed an evil."
AMEN !!!!! That's part of the evil in our world today...God help us
 

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Odd observation! Guess it's really better to never leave the house ...? Oh wait, then the invaders come to you. Guess you just can't win.
That would depend on where you live. There are places in the US and Canada, as well as places in Europe, where home invasions simply do not happen.
 

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Interesting outtakes for me from the video........

Also........I was amazed at how many people were sitting upright or even standing upright in those few seconds and right after.........the pastor was eating carpet as he should have been, but the congregation was not.

This is Texas, after all.......you'd think they'd have a good instinct for what to do when bullets are flying.
So, because it's Texas, parishioners going to church on Sunday should expect to be taking gunfire? That sounds a bit off to me, but I agree that gun owners EVERYWHERE going to church in these times should be armed and prepared. I certainly would if I attended services.
 

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Wilson said that the shooter half turned to face him.......he said nothing about intending a head shot or where he was aiming.

And he seems a little off on that because the video shows the shooter was just firing a shot toward the pastor when Wilson dropped him........he was actually turned a bit toward the pastor and looking more toward the pulpit at the front of the church.

As for the first guy that made that unfortunate attempt at drawing his gun.......all I see is him going down like a limp rag in mid draw. I saw no flash from his gun.

Of course, it's hard to tell because these videos go quite fast and it's really hard to get a read on it perfectly. And even the person involved may have little memory of what actually happened......some have no memory of it.

Nobody's going to get me to believe he wasn't aiming for center mass because that's what his training would have had him do.

However, anything is possible, isn't it?
 
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Discussion Starter #16
We go to the areas
Super Church", although in years past we went to one with about 2300 in attendance. Since 9/11 I have been carryin' every time I was there. Shortly after that attack one of the board members in the church pulled me aside and asked if I carried in church. The board knew of my interest in guns and the fact I owned a Security company as am a Private Investigator. I assured him I do. Previously only the Pastor knew.
I ain't gonna let these idiots kill my loved ones.
Jim
 

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Interesting outtakes for me from the video........

This is Texas, after all.......you'd think they'd have a good instinct for what to do when bullets are flying.
...
Seriously? You think we're are USED TO bullets flying everywhere all the time and know better, or should know better, about what to do?? Texas is gunfight city everywhere? Sorry, man, but you touched a raw nerve there. We are no more trigger-happy than AZ or OK, MO or any other reasonably free state. While I hear gunshots around me all the time, it is deer season and this is a rural area. Outside of deer season we hardly hear any shooting. We just had our 3rd murder in the county in 40 years - a 17 yr old kid getting pissed at something his buddy did.

We don't have high-noon showdowns, no one is shooting up the saloons, and certainly we don't have cowhands shooting up main street. Plus this was in the center of a close-in suburb of a major US city - in fact it was "landlocked" by that city.

Please get a grip on your knee-jerk assumptions.
 

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Wilson said that the shooter half turned to face him.......he said nothing about intending a head shot or where he was aiming.

And he seems a little off on that because the video shows the shooter was just firing a shot toward the pastor when Wilson dropped him........he was actually turned a bit toward the pastor and looking more toward the pulpit at the front of the church.

As for the first guy that made that unfortunate attempt at drawing his gun.......all I see is him going down like a limp rag in mid draw. I saw no flash from his gun.

Of course, it's hard to tell because these videos go quite fast and it's really hard to get a read on it perfectly. And even the person involved may have little memory of what actually happened......some have no memory of it.

Nobody's going to get me to believe he wasn't aiming for center mass because that's what his training would have had him do.

However, anything is possible, isn't it?
Concur on your analysis of the first guy. Looked like he was slow, and fumbling a bit. Can't say he stood any chance of drawing and firing before getting shot himself. Better to distract and defuse in that situation. He's got the drop on you, don't be stupid.

Just found a link in NBCDFW.com about the shot he took. https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/white-settlement-gunman-grew-angry-over-refused-requests-for-money-minister/2284425/ " The only clear shot I had was his head because I still had people in the pews that were not all the way down as low as they could. That was my one shot".

Indeed he shot once. And he certainly center-punched the guy's head.

I guess "Nobody's going to get me to believe " anything you don't want to believe - but those are Wilson's own words.
 

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Armchair quarterbacking. 20/20 hindsight. Whatever. Plain facts, bad guy is dead before he could kill more. RIP to those who are dead, and prayers for the one injured.

Now if we could just put this type of security in place in our schools....
 

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Concur on your analysis of the first guy. Looked like he was slow, and fumbling a bit. Can't say he stood any chance of drawing and firing before getting shot himself. Better to distract and defuse in that situation. He's got the drop on you, don't be stupid.

Just found a link in NBCDFW.com about the shot he took. https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/white-settlement-gunman-grew-angry-over-refused-requests-for-money-minister/2284425/ " The only clear shot I had was his head because I still had people in the pews that were not all the way down as low as they could. That was my one shot".
That's different.

He had a good reason for not going center mass then........AND made an amazing shot.

Good for him.
 
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