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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
One time a couple weeks ago I noticed that my friend was often stopping to clear her M&P .22 compact. I asked her what the problem was and it was FTE - not every round, but quite often. She had used Federal ammo and thought changing to CCI would make a difference, but it didn't.

Thinking it might have been a faulty extractor, I was going to tell her to phone S&W and send it back to be fixed, but I know that you need to do your own problem solving, so I told her to come over and we would give her gun a thorough cleaning.

OH MY........dirty doesn't describe it. She had been "cleaning" it but didn't really understand what thorough cleaning on those .22's means. There was the usual gunk built up at the end of the barrel, around the opening to the bore, and the corresponding area around the firing pin, but the barrel was really bad inside and everything else needed to be scrubbed vigorously with toothbrushes after going over all with dry patches. She tends to gently brush and I have to keep reminding her to put pressure on the brush and SCRUB.

The area around the extractor was also of particular interest. We had quite a pile of dirty tooth brushes when all was said and done. And then, of course, when we went over everything with a lightly oiled cloth a lot more black gunk came off.

End result was a pristine clean gun. The next time she took it out, she shot 40 or 50 rounds totally trouble free.

"A clean gun is a happy gun" is not just a cute saying. It is a reality. I told her she needs to give it a good cleaning after 100 rounds or less, which is about every other time she shoots it. And I also "mentioned" that it is good practice to clean a gun every time you shoot it. She is not a cleaning freak like I am, so might just do it every other time and that should be OK. Fact is no matter what kind of .22 ammo you use, it is dirty stuff, and the wax coating the various manufacturers use adds to the gunk build up.

It really does not take a lot of build up just inside the bore to make it a tiny bit tighter and have those brass casings stick like they are glued in when they expand!

Anyway, I'm happy that her gun is A-OK again.
 

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Glad you got her gun going again. I clean after every outing too. Just the way I was taught. Friend of mine cold not get 22 mags loaded in chamber or would bind and hard to extract. Told him bring me the cylinder and he did. Cleaned it about five times and shells slid in and out no problems. He said he did not know you had to clean the cylinder. He cleaned the barrel religiously.
 

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A new gun will also take time for the chamber surfaces to "burnish" through firing and extracting cartridges when it's clean. Leaving it dirty just slows down that process.
 
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I clean the entire gun after I shoot it.......every time. Not much trouble, and makes a gun very dependable. I think many people read the dependabilty tests, where they fire 1000's of rounds without cleaning. That's just a dependability TEST......not something that you're supposed to do! :rolleyes: Some people are stupid beyond belief!!!!! Bob
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
FOLLOW UP on my friend's gun: The gun worked once after I cleaned it, then went right back to FTE's all the time. I have two of these guns and know a lot of other women who also have them. With only one exception, everyone reports no problems, clean or dirty, and with whatever kind of ammo they feed them!

So my friend called S&W and they agreed that there is something wrong. It has been at the "hospital" for a few weeks. They told her 8 to 10 weeks for fixing and return. It used to be less than 2 weeks for S&W repairs, but at least they did let her know! In the meantime, I take one of my two M&P .22 compacts every time we go to the range so one or both of us can use it.

I know only one other woman who had a .22 compact lemon and she finally gave up on it after 2 or 3 trips back to Smith. I really hope this friend's one comes back and runs as reliably as all the others I know about!

I don't let my guns get super dirty in any case, but if I only fire 20 or 30 rounds I'll let this one sit until next week when I know it will be used again.

The only one I faithfully clean after every outing is my Browning 1911-22 and that is because the owner's manual very specifically tells you to clean it every single time you have shot it. On the other hand, my Ruger Mark IV manual tells you to clean it after 200 rounds (I think that is the number in the book but the manual is upstairs) and not to clean it too often. GO FIGURE.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
22s are inherently dirty some ammo not so much .Glad you instructed her in the correct way of cleaning any firearm !
As a follow up: My friend's gun works great after coming back from S&W. It will not shoot Geco, though, but neither will my two M&P compacts. It just will not! All .22lr rounds are coated, but the Geco ammo is the greasiest I've seen other than S&B .22lr, but after you wipe each round off on paper towels (yuck), it shoots accurately and reliably in my Browning 1911-22. It is also the cleanest shooting .22lr I've tried.
 

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I never take my comp target 22's apart. I take the grips off and dunk them in a heated ultrasonic bath for 30 minutes, blow out with compressed air, oil the pivots with light machine oil, replace the grips and call it good.
 

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One time a couple weeks ago I noticed that my friend was often stopping to clear her M&P .22 compact. I asked her what the problem was and it was FTE - not every round, but quite often. She had used Federal ammo and thought changing to CCI would make a difference, but it didn't.

Thinking it might have been a faulty extractor, I was going to tell her to phone S&W and send it back to be fixed, but I know that you need to do your own problem solving, so I told her to come over and we would give her gun a thorough cleaning.

OH MY........dirty doesn't describe it. She had been "cleaning" it but didn't really understand what thorough cleaning on those .22's means. There was the usual gunk built up at the end of the barrel, around the opening to the bore, and the corresponding area around the firing pin, but the barrel was really bad inside and everything else needed to be scrubbed vigorously with toothbrushes after going over all with dry patches. She tends to gently brush and I have to keep reminding her to put pressure on the brush and SCRUB.

The area around the extractor was also of particular interest. We had quite a pile of dirty tooth brushes when all was said and done. And then, of course, when we went over everything with a lightly oiled cloth a lot more black gunk came off.

End result was a pristine clean gun. The next time she took it out, she shot 40 or 50 rounds totally trouble free.

"A clean gun is a happy gun" is not just a cute saying. It is a reality. I told her she needs to give it a good cleaning after 100 rounds or less, which is about every other time she shoots it. And I also "mentioned" that it is good practice to clean a gun every time you shoot it. She is not a cleaning freak like I am, so might just do it every other time and that should be OK. Fact is no matter what kind of .22 ammo you use, it is dirty stuff, and the wax coating the various manufacturers use adds to the gunk build up.

It really does not take a lot of build up just inside the bore to make it a tiny bit tighter and have those brass casings stick like they are glued in when they expand!

Anyway, I'm happy that her gun is A-OK again.
Just finished reading this and have some questions re: full size .22 M&P. Am getting ready to send my gun to S & W for the FOURTH time to fix the issues with it jamming. I've tried most every kind of .22 ammo. It gets WORSE each time S & W sends it back to me. The last time, someone sent a note saying they fired "5 mags". No mention as to how many times it jammed. Took it to the range yesterday and it jammed with CCI small game as well as Winchester (which actually jammed one after another). Is there a magic number of "acceptable" jams for so many rounds? The note they sent also said "passed" but I'd sure like to know who would be comfortable giving this gun to their wife, mom, sister. I can't smack someone on the head with it nor scare off a coyote or two by throwing it at them. So I ask: is there such a thing as an acceptable number of jams?? Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!! And, yes, it is clean. Do I have a lemon???
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Just finished reading this and have some questions re: full size .22 M&P. Am getting ready to send my gun to S & W for the FOURTH time to fix the issues with it jamming. I've tried most every kind of .22 ammo. It gets WORSE each time S & W sends it back to me. The last time, someone sent a note saying they fired "5 mags". No mention as to how many times it jammed. Took it to the range yesterday and it jammed with CCI small game as well as Winchester (which actually jammed one after another). Is there a magic number of "acceptable" jams for so many rounds? The note they sent also said "passed" but I'd sure like to know who would be comfortable giving this gun to their wife, mom, sister. I can't smack someone on the head with it nor scare off a coyote or two by throwing it at them. So I ask: is there such a thing as an acceptable number of jams?? Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!! And, yes, it is clean. Do I have a lemon???
The full size .22 is not made by S&W, although they service them since it is their brand on the guns. I've read a lot of places that said they don't work nearly as well as the S&W M&P .22 compacts which are actually made by S&W in the US. I can't prove that - just what I've read.

If you are not limp wristing AT ALL, there is no such thing as an acceptable number of jams, providing you are not using a brand of ammo that your particular gun hates. In your case it sounds like your gun hates the Winchester. That is not surprising.

Some .22 semi autos won't work with anything except CCI Mini Mags. I have a Ruger Mark IV Lite like that. Fortunately I have a pretty good supply of CCI Mini Mags, because hubby has been using that gun regularly for the past few months for our club's weekly friendly competition shoot.

I strongly suggest you try CCI Mini Mags. If the gun still jams, get rid of it.
 

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The full size .22 is not made by S&W, although they service them since it is their brand on the guns. I've read a lot of places that said they don't work nearly as well as the S&W M&P .22 compacts which are actually made by S&W in the US. I can't prove that - just what I've read.

If you are not limp wristing AT ALL, there is no such thing as an acceptable number of jams, providing you are not using a brand of ammo that your particular gun hates. In your case it sounds like your gun hates the Winchester. That is not surprising.

Some .22 semi autos won't work with anything except CCI Mini Mags. I have a Ruger Mark IV Lite like that. Fortunately I have a pretty good supply of CCI Mini Mags, because hubby has been using that gun regularly for the past few months for our club's weekly friendly competition shoot.

I strongly suggest you try CCI Mini Mags. If the gun still jams, get rid of it.
Thank you! I do use mini mags ... the CCI small game and the CCI varmint. Those worked the best for me until I had the gun serviced. Esp after this last (3rd) time, it just jams up on anything. And like I stated earlier, my husband's S & W M&P compact fired each and every round my gun wouldn't shoot. We got a supervisor at S & W who said he'd watch the work done on my gun this 4th time so we'll try it once more. Then I'm just done with it. If I can't depend on it, what good is it?
Thanks for replying!
 

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Mine is a standard-length M&P .22 handgun. I use the same solid grip as with my Sig P225, CZ PCR, S&W 908 etc 9mm types.

The M&P was very unreliable with cheap Federal ammo, FTE/Fail To Extract about 10% of the time.....but worked far better with Rem. Golden Bullet.

The Solution ? ;) Many of you already can imagine.
> Shortened the recoil spring twice, to a total of about 1/2 inch.
Even my new, store-purchased Ruger Mark IV (skinny barrel) was generally unreliable over about 2,000 rounds of Federal, some GB, even a few CCI Minimags had FTE.
> Its spring was shorted about 1/3rd inch.
Both guns are now 98% - 100% reliable. A few older bulk Winchester rds. won't ignite. That's all.
 
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