[Blackcloud2]

I’ve bought one single gun through an FFL after all these years because I prefer fact-to-face purchases, it’s not been my norm. I’ve never sold a single firearm through an FFL and now I have a few questions, whether it’s here on this site or Gun Broker, I suspect it doesn’t really matter. First, I know of two local places (gun shops) that will act as FFL intermediaries, that shouldn’t be a problem, I understand they will have a set fee, I got that covered. One of my questions is, do I pre-pack the gun for shipping or do I have to deliver it to the FFL in naked form? If so, am I then expected to package it and if so, can I do it back at home or does it have to be within their view? Or, do they handle the packaging/ shipping and if so, is that an extra cost above their FFL fee? I’m prepared to pay the fee, just want to know. Payment for the firearm; if I’m selling, do I expect a payment back through them (my FFL) or directly from the seller or from his FFL? If the money is to come from a buyer themselves or their FFL, what is the most popular form of payment; wired cash, direct bank deposit, personal check, Money Order, Bank Cashier check? Does the FFL fee cover insurance costs? Lots of questions I should know the answer to, but I’m old school about selling/buying guns, I just prefer to have direct contact. That said, I’m thinking about selling some of my stash at a fair price in today’s market, but from my current view of the gun world, I can’t do it in person.

I realize these are strange questions coming from someone as senior to the Forum as I am, but it’s much like around the year 2002 and my late father realized that he couldn’t fish anymore and for the first time in his long life he was faced with buying fish from the grocery store, he was clueless! Well, I’m holding onto some good guns that I realize now I’ll not shoot and when I die, might not be sold to a deserving owner, instead liquidated for quick cash. In all fairness, my son will hold onto the ‘keepers’, but the rest will be chattel to him and the other kids, they’ll just sell them. Unlike my dad, I can buy fish at any grocer, cook it perfectly and different from my childhood meals, eat the fish easily without fear of choking on a bone! I don’t want to choke on a bone trying to sell some guns through an FFL, any help would be much appreciated!

 

[msharley]

Hey BC 2,

Each State is different.

Here, in Pa., if I were selling you, in Az. a firearm...

I would take it to my FFL..and pay him for the "Transfer/shipping" & he would box it up & send it. (He has to enter the serial # into his log....then where/which FFL it was shipped to. Usually about $20/$25 +shipping?)

A word to the wise....if you do not want a rare/custom/collectible firearm "lost"....insure it for $1501.00. (yes, it costs more. NO, when insured for that amount...........they DO NOT get LOST!)

Hope this helps.

Later, Mark

 

[Abby'sDad]

Do NOT prepack the gun as the dealer has to log the serial number into his bound book. Ask him if he will package the gun or if you need to bring the stuff to do so.

To payment, the buyer send YOU the money BEFORE the gun is shipped; cash the check (or whatever method you use, I prefer USPS money orders)
The FFL fee is that - his fee; shipping costs, insurance etc. are additional. If using USPS, send it registered with adult signature required.

 

[washerdude]

Be careful if you have an FFL consign your gun for sale. You give them physical possession and if it doesn't sell then you have to go through all the paperwork to get it back. They won't just give it back to you. If your status changes for any reason that you would not be able to purchase a firearm, the FFL keeps it. It happened to me. I was able to get my revolver back but cost me a transfer fee of $20. I thought since it was my gun i could just pick it up if it didn't sell. NOPE

 

[Abby'sDad]

Another thing, you can legally ship guns to the buyer's FFL (although some will not accept as is their prerogative)
if you ship, long guns can go USPS to his FFL; handguns cannot be shipped by a non-FFL via USPS and must go overnight via Fedex or UPS.

 

[Abby'sDad]

Be careful if you have an FFL consign your gun for sale. You give them physical possession and if it doesn't sell then you have to go through all the paperwork to get it back. They won't just give it back to you. If your status changes for any reason that you would not be able to purchase a firearm, the FFL keeps it. It happened to me. I was able to get my revolver back but cost me a transfer fee of $20. I thought since it was my gun i could just pick it up if it didn't sell. NOPE

Mine just charged me for the BG phone call as the state charges him $5.

 

[mrerick]

Best way will be to conduct your transaction directly with the buyer, and then pay the ffl to ship it to the buyer's FFL.

Best way to ship from a FFL to a FFL is via registered USPS because it's considerably less expensive than UPS and FedEx. In fact, that alone will cover your FFL fees.

Deliver it to the FFL unboxed. They have to run it through their records.

If it's more than 50 years old, or on the C&R list, you can get your own C&R FFL and ship across state lines, but you will end up paying the UPS or FedEx overnight express rates.

 

[gearchecker]

Stacy, You are not required by law to ship a gun thru FedEx or UPS Overnight. You can legally ship it ground service. It is rare that one of the national shippers employees know anything about the real rules for shipping guns. Kind of like cops not knowing everything about gun laws.
Let your FFL do all of the dirty work.
Is Apache Junction near you at all? AJI's sporting goods is an excellent FFL dealer, and treats their customers quite well. They do many transfers, and they'll make you feel comfortable about the whole transfer thing. I've done business with them as a customer, and thru the shop I'm at now, doing transfers for a couple of their customers shipping guns up to us.

AJI Sporting Goods
Gun shop
10444 E Apache Trail · (480) 984-8616
Open 9AM - 6PM

 

[Abby'sDad]

Stacy, You are not required by law to ship a gun thru FedEx or UPS Overnight. You can legally ship it ground service. It is rare that one of the national shippers employees know anything about the real rules for shipping guns. Kind of like cops not knowing everything about gun laws.
Let your FFL do all of the dirty work.
Is Apache Junction near you at all? AJI's sporting goods is an excellent FFL dealer, and treats their customers quite well. They do many transfers, and they'll make you feel comfortable about the whole transfer thing. I've done business with them as a customer, and thru the shop I'm at now doing transfers for a couple of their customers shipping guns up to us.

View attachment 498009
AJI Sporting Goods
Gun shop
10444 E Apache Trail · (480) 984-8616
Open 9AM - 6PM

Not true, both UPS and Fedex, in their TARIFFS, do not allow the shipment of handguns via ground; they MUST go by air. This is because of employee theft, no other reason.

 

[gearchecker]

Answers to your questions..
Do I pre-pack the gun for shipping or do I have to deliver it to the FFL in naked form?
Yes it must not be pre-packed. The FFL will need to enter the transfers into his books.

Do they handle the packaging/ shipping and if so, is that an extra cost above their FFL fee?
FFL holders usually charge 2-3 different fees for transferring a gun out of their store.
A) The actual cost of the transfer. Transfer fees cover the cost of the BATFE Paperwork.
B) They will charge you for the cost of shipping. This covers what they'll charge you to cover their shipping fees. (B2) Most of the time their price will include the cost of any packaging they'll use to ship out the gun. The packaging may me costed separately.
Whenever possible, see if your FFL dealer will be mail it out using the USPS. Postal shipping costs are much lower than UPS or FedEx. This may save you some money.
Does the FFL fee cover insurance costs? Usually not, insurance most of the time is an added fee to the customer.
You should agree in advance with the buyer if they want insurance on their package, or not. Insurance would be added to the shipping costs, and should always be the buyers responsibility, unless you agree at the beginning that the insurance is covered by you. When I sell a gun I usually have the buyer add $10 for the first $500, and $1 for each $100 after that.
Payment for the firearm; if I’m selling, do I expect a payment back through them (my FFL) or directly from the seller or from his FFL?
The buyer should send the money directly to you. I recommend either a US Postal Money Order, or a Certified bank check. Many will also consider payment thru Money Orders, or funds transfer thru Walmart Pay or some other agreed upon electronic method. But make sure they send the money to you, not your FFL dealer.
I do not accept any form of Money Order because they're very easy to counterfeit. Do not ever use a direct bank transfer. This would give the buyer your bank account information and that's a very bad thing.

If you sell a long gun you are allowed to use the US Postal Service to mail it out yourself. There are boxes available that are long enough to pack and safely ship a long gun. Those boxes cost somewhere between $5-10. If you're creative you can also build your own box.
But make sure the buyers FFL dealer will accept a delivery from a non FFL Holder before you have it shipped out. If they do, it is much less expensive to mail it out yourself, since there would be no FFL fees on your end. [My shop only requires a copy of the sellers drivers license be included in the box with the gun, if privately shipped.]
All handgun transfers must be done between FFL dealers.
You can not, under any circumstance pack or ship any ammo with the firearm you're shipping out. That is against federal law.

Lastly, don't ever put any type of markings on the box indicating that there's a firearm in the box. that's a surefire way to get the gun to "disappear" in the shipping.
I've personally shipped probably close to 200 guns , so what I'm telling you is correct, it's not what somebody heard what you can or can't do, or this or that.

 

[Waidmann]

The only question I see is whether you intend to allow a 3 day no firing inspection with the buyer to return shipping. This is a somewhat common feature.

 

[Abby'sDad]

And especially true for higher end expensive guns with some age to them

 

[ussmanlovede36]

I don't have an FFL so when I sell I go through an FFL and pay their fee. They handle everything and if it sells on GB they handle everything. I just go back and pick up my check.

 

[mrerick]

Locally, UPS and FedEx require you to identify the package as containing a firearm on the manifest, and then will require overnight express shipping. It's the reason I won't use either of them for shipping a firearm. They may treat a business FFL differently than an individual or collector.

With USPS they required a copy of the FFL folded so the contents are not visible and in an envelope stuck on the outside of the package. Only business FFLs can ship handguns via USPS (they won' t honor a C&R FFL from a collector).

This might be at the discretion of the postmaster, and rules keep changing in the USPS regulations.

In any case, I do all shipments through the business FFLs that I know and work with...

 

[MWAG]

Another thing, you can legally ship guns to the buyer's FFL (although some will not accept as is their prerogative)
if you ship, long guns can go USPS to his FFL; handguns cannot be shipped by a non-FFL via USPS and must go overnight via Fedex or UPS.

True, but given the requirement to ship overnight, you will spend about a hundred bucks on shipping a handgun, where the FFL may only spend $35 for a slightly longer shipping time.

 

[Abby'sDad]

True, but given the requirement to ship overnight, you will spend about a hundred bucks on shipping a handgun, where the FFL may only spend $35 for a slightly longer shipping time.

EXACTLY, which is why, for handguns at least, it is (usually) cheaper to use your local FFL so he can use USPS flat rate box

 

[MWAG]

The caveat is that currently with the gun industry so busy, the $65 upcharge to sending it yourself may be something to consider if you don't want the headache and the time-consuming task of taking it to your FFL, filling out paperwork, and it still not going out for a day because they're so backed up. The FFL I use asks me to get the FFL certficate from the receiving store for them, because it's a royal PITA and takes multiple emails and phone calls to get it, and they are correct. But it's not that big a deal in the long run, especially if you're only doing it once.

 

[ShooterGranny]

The last gun we had our preferred FFL ship to the FFL on the other end: Hubby took the USPS Priority Mail box with the gun to the FFL. The FFL packaged it and put the required information inside. It went to the post office the same day.

That was on Dec 12 last year. The 2 day priority mail package took until Dec 24 to arrive, at which time the new owner (my granddaughter) was at her parents' house for Christmas, so she never actually received the gun until around Jan 5 or 6. AND in the middle of it all they came to visit us. But the law says you cannot gift a gun personally hand-to-hand even to a family member if that member lives out of state so we followed the law. End result: She has her gun (formerly my Glock 42) and I was able to give her 4 boxes of ammo when they did come to visit.

It is not hard to stay within the law. Just costs a bit of money.

 

[timetripper]

I've always included shipping costs in my prices when selling online.
FFL costs for me have ranged from $30 to $75, and that always included shipping, insurance AND lately a signature. Flat rate USPS box is the best way and usually cheapest. It will go anywhere in the lower 48 and even to some of Alaska for the same price. Just check with your FFL ahead of time to confirm that they use USPS. I've found some who wont.
Get your own box and label. They are free at the post office. I always prepackage everything up without sealing before I go to my FFL as they do need to see a serial number. I also include a cover letter which includes the buyers information, a description of the item, the sending FFL info with a copy of their FFL license, which I usually receive from the buyer in his payment check correspondence. Sometimes it is possible to download it from the FFL's website. Include phone numbers all around too.
Whenever possible I contact the receiving FFL by phone to give them a heads up on the transaction. All have asked for the buyers information and contact phone number. Apparently it is not uncommon for them to receive packages with no information as to who it belongs!
Most FFL's can do the shipping part online and print a shipping label at their store. Always insure, it doesn't cost that much for the extra coverage. You will get a tracking number too, which I send on to the buyer. Lately I have been paying the extra $10 for a delivery signature. That helps to ensure that the package wont be left on the wrong doorstep.

Good luck!

John

 

[Rule3]

Stacy, You are not required by law to ship a gun thru FedEx or UPS Overnight. You can legally ship it ground service. It is rare that one of the national shippers employees know anything about the real rules for shipping guns. Kind of like cops not knowing everything about gun laws.
Let your FFL do all of the dirty work.
Is Apache Junction near you at all? AJI's sporting goods is an excellent FFL dealer, and treats their customers quite well. They do many transfers, and they'll make you feel comfortable about the whole transfer thing. I've done business with them as a customer, and thru the shop I'm at now, doing transfers for a couple of their customers shipping guns up to us.

View attachment 498009
AJI Sporting Goods
Gun shop
10444 E Apache Trail · (480) 984-8616
Open 9AM - 6PM

UPS and Fed EX require overnight for a Handgun.

https://d3ciwvs59ifrt8.cloudfront.net/985b5425-83f5-4c19-8ba7-bcc9ff31c0f6/67e6049e-d459-49dd-9ef4-7bdf61c8e285.pdf

Shipping Firearms and Ammunition | UPS - United States

The shipper must comply with and must ensure that each shipment containing firearms complies with all federal, state and local laws applicable to the shipper, recipient, and package, including, without limitation, age restrictions.

www.ups.com

If shipping through a FFL let them deal with it all. USPS Priority is the cheapest

I had a "deal" with my former FFL, I had the Priority Box all labeled ((USPS.com) with the FFL address along with a copy of the receiving FFL, The Box was not sealed. All he had to do was record the serial number close and tape the box. Done in the mail.