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Discussion Starter #1
Think we'll call this one baby ....

It's not often that you find a small original No. 4 Remington Rolling Block take-down ~ in .22 Rimfire....that is still intact. ;)




 

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Yeah! That's my kind of .22! I like the various small frame rolling blocks better than the Stevens Favorites.

Good bore?

Eli Whitney made RBs, too - both were very popular and inexpensive, but few survived in very fine condition.

xtm
 
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Discussion Starter #3
xtm....

the bore was the issue for me, before buying the gun. It was filthy. Not black ~ but looked like it had been shot alot, and not cleaned for some years...

As it turns out, after more then 2.5 hrs of careful cleaning...Lead is a great preservative. ;) That bore is as shiny and new as any of my modern guns.... :mrgreen:

I at least expected it to be dull....never thought it would clean out to bright and shiny....

giz
 

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Sweet...

Now go pile it on some rocks will ya.... we just wanna be sure it's really you.... :lol:
 
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Discussion Starter #5
Drew,

Would you make that out as a factory Remington sight?

I'm going to do exactly that, when the sun comes out...Put her next to her massive big brother ~ my 45/70 Roller...just so folks understand how small she really is...

I've seen three of these that were complete (had all the parts) in my years of collecting....this is number 3 :mrgreen:

giz
 

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Had a TD in .25 Rim a few years ago.... well, longer than that I guess..... was before you met me.... at the time I was on a Rolling Block Binge.... albeit short lived.... this example had easily 75% of the case color and was otherwise mint in every way..... it resides now in a collection in Vermont. The standing price is 10 TIMES the $600 that I sold it for.

That sight has the look of an early Marble's "Simplex".... I'd have to check my early Remington catalogs to see if it is correct as a factory option. Still, it's a very old sight..... turn of the century or so....

Some more close ups would be helpful.... I'll dig out my references.

Drew
 
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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks Drew,

I'll try to get pics of the gun tomorrow in natural light. The rear sight is mounted from underneath and has no screws tapped into the receiver. So they have to be inletted into the stock below the metal. That would seem to be more of a factory option then a rework. I've gone over some of my books and do not yet see this as a factory option. Gonna have to show you how the elevator works on this one, only one of it's kind that I've seen. Friction latch...

giz
 

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My brother used to collect those things. I never really got into them, though. I did have fun shooting them with my brother. His widow gave them all to a friend and he took them to a gun show in Salt Lake City - sad.

I wouldn't mind having been able to bring one home with me.
 

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James Grant has a chapter on Remington Boy's rifles in his great book Boys Single Shot Rifles - 2nd from the top:


I just re-read the section on the #4. Grant states that the takedown version was made from ~1903-1933. The earlier takedowns had a simple slip-in barrel shank secured by a screw with a wing-lever protrusion which engaged a half-round recess on the underside of the barrel. Later versions used a coin-slotted member on the takedown screw. Most of the takedown barrels were round and were 22 1/2" long.

List price was $8.00, but Sears and Roebuck and Stoegers both sold them for $5.00. The gallery or sporting peep sight cost half what the rifle did - $2.50.

xtm
 
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Discussion Starter #10
xtm...

Is there a picture of the gallery sight in the book? I'm facinated by the peep sight on this gun, not quite seen another like it....

giz
 

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Unfortunately, Grant has no photographs of the "peep" sight offered for the #4 - several showing the long range sights in another of his books. I do know that the Rem. tang sights were standardized for all models. The holes drilled and tapped for all their tang sights was 1 15/16" center-to-center. Rem. sights had the vernier staff mounted well forward on the base and the rear portion of the base was twice as long as the forward portion and extended nearly to the rear of the tang itself. Clear?

Your photo shows a base that has the staff mounted ~ in the center, so I believe it to be a non-Rem. sight. Also, I believe I see a plug in the rear tang screw hole. It looks like someone made use of the forward hole and drilled his own rear hole to fit the sight at hand. Are those brass rivets holding the tang base in place? Screwed outward from the inside and expertly peened in place?

Every single one of the many gunmakers of that era had their own design for a basic peep sight that they felt was better than the next. Hard to tell what that one is, but I think that it is from a Flobert gallery or "saloon" rifle and was adapted to fit your #4. It is probably unmarked underneath, so removal may not answer the question. If the base is still firmly-attatched, I'd leave it as it is and make practical use of the sight. It's been mounted there for so long, it's part of the history of the rifle.

xtm
 
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Discussion Starter #12
xtm,

Interesting and bears looking into some more. One other thing. The front sight is a peep on my No. 4 :)

It is the classic Marbles narrow dovetail with a peep thru the base. Neat thing, really...you line up the rear peep to the front peep. Look right thru your front sight to see the target...

giz
 

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!!

Another reason to believe that the sights were robbed from an indoor gallery rifle of some sort. the front peeps were drilled and sized to match the O.D. of the round black target bull. When sized exactly, all you would see was black with a perfect sight picture. If you were a little off, you would see a little "light" on one side or the other.

They work OK when the front "peep" hole is slightly oversized, too - you just center the black bull. I realize that you already know all this, but some of the readers might not! :)

This sight arrangement doesn't work quite as well for small game hunting as it does for target shooting.

xtm
 

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Giz,

The tang and vernier sight shown in the Remington 1904 Catalog bare no resemblance to the one on your rifle. Generally, they are of the "Ladder" type with graduations. adjust-ability is either via a threaded turn screw or screw in adjustable eye-piece.

By the 1912 Catalog all the tang sights seem to be the familiar Lyman "Combination" type.

However, following my hunch, I found a photograph of the Marble's "Simplex" in Nick Stroebel's book..... it bears a strong resemblance to the sight in your snapshot. To be correct for your rifle it should be marked "S7S" or "R3".

I have the codes here so if you do remove that sight, or can identify any other markings, let me know and I will de-code for you....

Drew
 
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Discussion Starter #16
Thanks guys....as yet the sight is not indentified but Drew is hot on the trail :) .

I'm going to get some better pics of it and the front sight to show everyone else what were talking about....

giz
 
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Discussion Starter #17
This shot explains why I call the gun Baby...

Here she is, all cleaned up, and next to a 45/70 Rem. Rolling Block.



giz
 

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"Simplex" is shown in the very rear right of that photograph.

The dead give away to me was the seam line on the staff of the sight shown in Giz's photo.

Simplex was a stamped steel assembly.
 
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