Another way to look at "Universal Background Checks"...
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Thread: Another way to look at "Universal Background Checks"...

  1. #11
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    Actually, a revised system could eliminate having to go to a FFL for anything having to do with getting your background checked.

    If you could do it from your smartphone or from home, and acquire an encrypted token that proves you're qualified for a transfer (and have an opportunity to correct any NICS errors encountered before you went to the FFL) that would be an improvement.

    The key is that every citizen would be able to independently and privately get their "Qualified" digital token. Using a second application or web site, every seller (private or FFL) could compare a Real ID with the details unlocked at time of transfer from the encrypted token. The seller would get a record of the buyer's approved status. All of this kept private between buyer and seller. No central record keeping of anything related to the transaction.

    Nothing involved in getting such a token or using it later should involved cost to the citizen. That would, as you correctly say, be like a "poll tax". The government should bear the entire cost of these schemes including populating the systems and running them as well as providing websites and apps for using them. That is an improvement.

    This actually could eliminate all FFL transfer costs. If the leftists want these things, let THEM fund the systems and what it takes to maintain them.
    sig_230 likes this.
    Cheers! Marc


    Check out my Gun Rights BLOG at: http://skilledshot.wordpress.com
    accipere facile, sed sumite! - Take it easy, but take it!
    NRA Certified Instructor: Pistol; Personal Protection Inside and Outside the Home; Rifle; Reloading: Chief RSO
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  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waidmann View Post
    Here is how I look at it. Meeting some person you do not know at a presumed neutral/safe location for the purpose of selling a firearm solely based on the exchange of money is: perhaps dangerous, possibly immoral and likely demonstrates poor judgement.

    Allowing a family member to claim an inheritance, selling a gun to: your LGS buddy who has passed numerous checks, a business acquaintance who has been vetted by either the TSA, ATF, DOE or similar, or a LEO, or your long standing neighbor is within my definition of reason. Loaning your duck gun, skeet gun etc. to a friend, ditto.

    Telling me I have to pay the LGS to acquire and dispose of everything I would have otherwise moved privately is distasteful.

    I suppose there will eventually be some crazy compromise creating a new class of weapons, a 21 year old age level, a background check mandated for them etc., something affecting the whole 80% lower category. We will see. What I do not see is universal registration, a surrender/purchase mandated prohibition or worse in the first round.
    Your position is clear and is understood, yet runs counter to my opinion based on life experience living in the southwest, which unsurprisingly differs from many living east of the Mississippi River. Selling a gun ‘person to person’ in Arizona does actually require proof of the buyer to be an Arizona resident (drivers license), which I admit doesn’t always happen, but it does with LAW ABIDING CITIZENS! Why should an inheritance of a firearm become, by law, a crime? Should we restrict inherited cars, boats and planes also because they MIGHT be used in the course of a crime? No, that’s not the point.

    The point is that many people, including some here on this fine forum, a forum blessed with firearm geniuses’, you’re falling for a simple ruse, the “Three Card Monty” so to speak. While we focus on ‘nits and nats’ during argument sessions, the government is implementing plans to completely shut down firearm ownership through legislative measures, AND criminals consistently acquire firearms illegally. If you invoke or challenge others today, defending the Second Amendment of the Constitution, not many beyond this forum will appreciate the difficult task. The original Constitution wasn’t accepted, so the state reps demanded and inserted 10 original ‘Amendments’ to the Constitution, which we all now accept as law. So many today think that these Amendments were original intent, they weren’t and for a good reason, they came by way of challenge!
    Injunbro and lawdog like this.
    “So son, explain again exactly why there’s a stripper in your bedroom?"

  3. #13
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    I guess I'm interested in changes that will actually reduce the risk to liberty by these infringing systems.

    None of it stops criminals.

    All of it diverts funds needed by police to actually fight criminals and terrorists.

    The current system (which includes collecting the records of FFLs when they go out of business and storing them at the ATF) creates a risk of establishing a gun registration system.

    We have an opportunity to eliminate the existing system, satisfy the need to check backgrounds for lawful transfers, AND make it easier, more efficient and less expensive to lawfully acquire guns.

    There is give and take in the political process. Leftists are screaming for "Universal background checks" that we know won't stop criminals. But that doesn't matter. Why not use the opportunity to change the system to completely and securely privatize the gun transfer process itself?

    Technology lets such a system be constructed, can reduce the cost of administrating it (freeing up money for actual police work), and move the process of establishing your status for acquiring guns to a private personal action from your smart phone or computer web browser.

    As long as the law prohibits recording the actions of qualifying your status to acquire a firearm, there is no transaction or transfer record to use for later registration schemes.

    When a private or commercial seller wants to transfer a firearm, they privately unlock the buyer's encrypted token so that they can verify their identity, and that they are not prohibited. Nothing needs to be done in a central system at that time. There is no central record of the transaction because it doesn't take place in a central system, yet the seller has proof that they transferred the gun to someone that is qualified to have it. The identity of seller and buyer are private and shared only between those two people. The seller can verify the identity against the government issued Real ID card...

    That is an improvement over current systems, is much more private, and more resistant to registration schemes. It also becomes "Universal" for all lawful transfers (which are, when all is said and done, the only ones that can be controlled by such a system).

    In effect the leftists get what they want (in name), while actually making things better for gun owners in a way that the ignorant leftists don't understand because they don't know anything about how NICS actually works.

    The entire encrypted token based system can work even at gun shows where every individual can have both the encrypted token acquisition app and the identity verification app.

    No FFL needs to ever be involved.
    sig_230 likes this.
    Cheers! Marc


    Check out my Gun Rights BLOG at: http://skilledshot.wordpress.com
    accipere facile, sed sumite! - Take it easy, but take it!
    NRA Certified Instructor: Pistol; Personal Protection Inside and Outside the Home; Rifle; Reloading: Chief RSO
    NC DOJ Concealed Carry Instructor; Appointed Member North Carolina Criminal Justice Information Network

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  5. #14
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    It's very simple, I never sell anyone (except family) a firearm without going thru an FFL! That way there is a trail of it leaving my possession and going into the buyer's possession. A simple and easy solution that only costs a few bucks. No worries, mate!

  6. #15
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    BC2 I am not falling for anything. I am recognizing a current that has largely flowed in one direction since 1934. It rarely reverses course and when it does it is over issues like reimportation of military surplus. Some real gains have occurred in some states but that is not the federal one size fits everyone world. Some days simply retarding the rate of that flow is a win. That is in my opinion reality. I am not cheering it on.
    Blackcloud2 likes this.

  7. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waidmann View Post
    Here is how I look at it. Meeting some person you do not know at a presumed neutral/safe location for the purpose of selling a firearm solely based on the exchange of money is: perhaps dangerous, possibly immoral and likely demonstrates poor judgement.

    Allowing a family member to claim an inheritance, selling a gun to: your LGS buddy who has passed numerous checks, a business acquaintance who has been vetted by either the TSA, ATF, DOE or similar, or a LEO, or your long standing neighbor is within my definition of reason. Loaning your duck gun, skeet gun etc. to a friend, ditto.

    Telling me I have to pay the LGS to acquire and dispose of everything I would have otherwise moved privately is distasteful.

    I suppose there will eventually be some crazy compromise creating a new class of weapons, a 21 year old age level, a background check mandated for them etc., something affecting the whole 80% lower category. We will see. What I do not see is universal registration, a surrender/purchase mandated prohibition or worse in the first round.
    How about a Citizenship ID Card, if you wanna Register people for ANY Government Benefit, Voting, etc.? We can then have REAL I.D., and to Hell with ANYTHING that "infringes" on the Right to Keep and Bear Arms (which doesn't seem to be interpreted plainly by the USSC, as they are total political tools now)?
    Injunbro, mrerick and Blackcloud2 like this.

  8. #17
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    Citizenship alone is no guarranty of sanity, likelyhood of being prone to violence or lack of character. I wish I had some simple solutions to offer.


 
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